Saturday, August 24, 2013
Churches Seek Shelter from Supreme Court Definition of Marriage
Worried they could be sued by gay couples, some churches are changing their bylaws to reflect their view that the Bible allows only marriage between one man and one woman. Some churches fear that it's only a matter of time before one of them is sued by a gay couple that asks to be married in a church they have attended and are refused because the church believes as a matter of faith that Christian marriage is reserved for heterosexual couples. AP cites some examples : "I thought marriage was always between one man and one woman, but the Supreme Court in a 5-4 decision said no," said Gregory S. Erwin, an attorney for the Louisiana Baptist Convention, an association of Southern Baptist churches and one several groups advising churches to change their bylaws. "I think it's better to be prepared because the law is changing. America is changing." Erwin was referring to the June Supreme Court decision in which the Court struck down a definition in a federal law that states that marriage must be between a man and a woman to qualify for certain federal benefits. The decision refers only to the federal government. And, in California, Kevin Snider, an attorney with the Pacific Justice Institute, a nonprofit legal defense group that specializes in conservative Christian issues, said his organization released a model marriage policy a few years ago in response to a statewide gay marriage fight in California. Snider said some religious leaders have been threatened with lawsuits for declining to perform same-sex wedding ceremonies. ~~~~~ The US Constitution is very clear about keeping the government out of religion : "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances." (United States Constitution, Amendment I, 1791; see also Article VI.). This prohibition of governmental meddling in the personal freedom of religion has been widely upheld as such. BUT, and it is a big "but," the Supreme Court has often interferred in
the religious freedom guaranteed by the Constitution as a matter of equal rights for minorities. The Fourteenth Amendment has been read by the Supreme Court to prohibit discrimination on the basis of religion : "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the law." It is the Fourteenth Amendment that has been the basis for long list of cases that include halting the reading of the Bible or mandatory prayer in public schools and eliminating Christmas creches in public buildings, There was such a public and congressional outcry when the Court seemed poised to eliminate the words "under God" from the Pledge of Allegiance to the national flag that the Court found a procedural reason to settle the case without tossing out the words "under God." But the Court cases embrace more than Christian beliefs -- the Court has eliminated polygamy, protected Native American religious ceremonies, and forced education and minimum life-saving medical intervention for children, all under the Fourteenth Amendment and a broad constitutional principle articulated over and over by the Founders - separation of church and state. ~~~~~ So, dear readers, it may be wise for Christian churches that believe as a matter of faith that marriage may only be undertaken between a man and a woman to spell it out now. It seems unlikely that the Supreme Court would force a church to perform a ceremony that relates to a civil right not recognized by the particular church, i.e., performing religious marriage ceremonies for gay couples. But, it might be safer to act now. If such a case were upheld, it would be harder to seek written shelter after the fact.
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" ~~~~~ The US Constitution is very clear about keeping the government out of religion : "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances." (United States Constitution, Amendment I, 1791; see also Article VI.)".
ReplyDeleteA question from a flyweight in legal matters of the people v the Supreme Court. If there is this "separation" of church and state, and if the Constitution is very CLEAR in keeping the the Government out of religion ... why then would the SCOTUS even agree to entertain or hear any arguments to the contrary of the Government staying out of religion based on the Constitution clearness of this matter?
My only question , because I am confused.
NEVER seek shelter after the fact because it does one no good.
ReplyDeleteHow does a Christian Church, Catholic Church, Jewish Synagog, etc. see marriage as anything but a "union between a man and a woman"!
ReplyDeleteIf we are taking about the Biblical sense of marriage, it can be nothing more and nothing less. Now if the premise that a "marriage" exist equally in society as it does in the eyes of God, then the whole ballgame is open for anything and everything, isn't it!
The Constitution and The Bill of Rights I think makes it very clear where this country, government operational stand is bound on issues (of this importance). The Covenant of marriage is quiet possibly the most sacred one that we have with God directly. And in my simple beliefs I don't think that it's open for much Political Correctness, gender equalizing, knee jerk reaction, minority fringe appeasement, voter block satisfaction Supreme Court ruling.
Marriage has ALWAYS been since the time of man started between a man and a woman. Not 2 men or 2 women. And if we are to continue down this "slippery slope" of questioning marriage and getting legal opinions, and as former president Bill Clinton said on another fringe subject ... "depends what IS means".
No it doesn't depend on what one specific word that the court system may want to zero in on means. What it really means is our individual belief in the word of God and how we as individuals are going to protect that relationship that we have with our God.
If the desire is to open marriage to union and ones deepest wish is to eventually be able to marry his/hers dog. then go out into the back yard (which is 'Fido's world) your speak a few words, Fido barks and there you have it marriage and lifetime bliss. this is certainly trying to prove my point via absurdity or is it. Such action may just be a little further down this slippery slope that we're about to go down.
This is yet another invasion to equalize the world for all the far out fringes
Again Casey Pops raises a very important social and Geo-political question. or as i read her article she does.
ReplyDeleteIs something as sacred and important as the state of marriage really needing to be defined by 9 men and women in black robes in Washington DC.
The monies that this "protection" will cost the church organizations (individually perhaps) would be better spent,(as the donors via weekly donations intended)doing "church" work.
If this is the train wreck that we and the churches are headed for then why don't they pool their monies, effort, save time and go to the SCOTUS and get a ruling before they/we are the defendants.They dirty old folks who want to keep some other group of citizens of this world down and without their rights. And by the way where do RIGHTS come from ... not governments for sure. they can't give us rights but they sure do trample on them legally.
ReplyDelete"Start by doing what's necessary; then do what's possible; and suddenly you are doing the impossible."
St.Francis of Assisi
Doer anyone in their right mind, political bent set aside, really needs to have the SCOTUS tell us exactly what marriage is or isn't.
ReplyDeleteDo we really? And if we do then we are either so terribly stupid or we are of the crowd that wants the system to be our guide and not God and/or our conscious. Either way we the sane and believing citizens of the world are in peril.
The first word is Does not Doer.
DeleteS O R R Y
"If not now then when ... If not us then who"
ReplyDeletePresident Reagan
We have to a large extent given up our personal privacy to the feds. They tax us for programs we don't want. They refuse to bit the PC bullet and reform the illegal welfare, food stamp programs, Illegal immigration is killing our hospital ER facilities, and our "youth's (16-22 years old)are without much hope of finding a job because the illegal community has somehow found a way to get ID that gets them the job (and that is OK with the Obama administration folks)
So maybe if President Reagan was here today (what a blessing that would be)he would say ...: "Why not us and why not right now."
ReplyDeleteIn the past, when gays were flamboyant as drag queens or as leather queens or whatever, that just amused people. And most of the people that come and watch the gay Halloween parade, where all those excesses are on display, those are straight families, and they think it's funny.
What isn't funny to most people is when the two married men or women suddenly move in next door to you (and your family), they adopt a foreign born child and they want to send the child to school with your child, then they want to share a drink, etc, etc. That is what creeps most people out - most notably Christians
So, I don't think gay marriage is a conservative issue. I think it's a radical issue. One that does not sit well the majority of people. It's a change that they don't think is ever to be timely, warranted, or necessary.
Marriage is for a man and women. Legal unions for any other combination of men, women, and those who may have been one once and are now the other.
We need to stop conceding to the fringes of society just because they think that their life is not equal to our ... ours has unlimited opening with a wide spectrum of inhabitants.